arcane toilet

[chillworld]

Hi Leander,

I have said this on the dutch forum and they didn't take it serious.
There is a bg in the arcane toilet with epic weekends.
After the update of the toilet the epic weekends don't give so much epic in the shop with refreshing than before.
here is a video of before the update :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XjgbK05pQWM

For the moment if I refresh with epic weekend or normal day, its stays almost the same.
At the moment it takes me minimum 50 paddos to just find 1 epic, not finding an epic for 100 refresh is also very common.

Mine gues of what's go wrong is first the calculation of epic weekend and after that the calculation of better items for the toilet, what results in that the toilet give better item for that space, just that space was an epic and turns to normal item.

Thx in advance.

Chill

[Lillikurd]

That guess makes no sense. The toilet isn't connected to the chance of finding epics.
Your aura level increases the base points from which item attributes are calculated. That's what it does, nothing more, nothing less.

Slots in the shops are filled randomly. The odds may or may not have changed (my guess is, they haven't, and you were just unlucky those times), but it's not a toilet related bug.

[Leander]

Yes, this isn't a bug. The epic weekend just increases the chance per slot to have an epic item generated.

The toilet only adds mana to your tank's mana level ONCE a day and also generates a new item for your class. It you throw a normal item into the toilet, you will receive a normal item. If you throw an epic item into the toilet, you'll get an epic item.

If you drop the second, third etc. item of the day you won't get more mana points but you will still get a normal or epic item in return...with the difference that this item is NOT for your class but for one of the others. If you are a mage you will only get hunter or warrior items to be used for your companions in the tower.

The epic event doesn't affect the toilet at all.

[chillworld]

Hi all,

I've talked a lot of ppl and who seems to agree that the odds are a lot less now than before.
I don't know if you tried to consume 400 paddos for just get 3 - 4 epics.
Its not just 1 epic weekend I had bad luck, its all the epic weekends.
I "feel" that there is almost no difference between epic weekend and normal day.
The aura indeed gives us better items but how is it implemented?
You make a gues that the base stats are raised, I make the gues they "replace" some items for some better items. This is also easier to implement and removed than really change the part of gereration of the items. for ex the code can be :

generateWeaponsForShop();
if (game.isEpicWeekend){updateWeaponsEpicWeekend();}
updateWeaonsArcaneToilet(player.getAura());

There are a million ways to program things that work so as long I don't know the code I just can ask to verify based on mine experiance in programming.

I hope that some people will react when they agree with me that the chances are now lower than it used to be.
If it was an update to lower the chances I must have missed the update log.

Thx in advance.

Greetz Chill.

[Lillikurd]

Hi all,

I've talked a lot of ppl and who seems to agree that the odds are a lot less now than before.

That doesn't make it statistically sound.

I don't know if you tried to consume 400 paddos for just get 3 - 4 epics.

Please calculate what the expected value is, and in which part of the Poisson distribution your observation falls.

Its not just 1 epic weekend I had bad luck, its all the epic weekends.

Better not visit the casino in a while then.

I "feel" that there is almost no difference between epic weekend and normal day.
The aura indeed gives us better items but how is it implemented?

Like I said, the aura is added to the level to generate a base level from which the stats are calculated.

You make a gues

It's not a guess. This is how it was explained on the US forum.

I make the gues they "replace" some items for some better items.

The aura level operates on all items in the shop, including epics.

This is also easier to implement and removed than really change the part of gereration of the items. for ex the code can be :

generateWeaponsForShop();
if (game.isEpicWeekend){updateWeaponsEpicWeekend();}
updateWeaonsArcaneToilet(player.getAura());

That doesn't make sense, and no way it would be easier to implement. The slots of the shop are filled randomly, on every occasion that the shop is refreshed. Every time a slot is filled, there is a small chance that the slot is filled with an epic item. A random number is generated, if it is above (or below) a certain limit, the slot is filled with an epic item. Let's call this limit L.

Then, the type of item is chosen (helmet, armour, gloves, etc. also, randomly), and then the style and colour (once again, randomly). Finally, the stats are generated, from a base level plus a bit of randomness.

The only thing that changes during epic weekend is the value for L, which is 1 if-then statement. Everything else remains the same. How can it be simpler.

I hope that some people will react when they agree with me that the chances are now lower than it used to be.

Even if they did agree, and even if they all were right, it has nothing to do with the toilet.

[chillworld]

Hey Lillikurd,

I'm a little frustrated about your answer.
Let me explain why.
I know you are not a part of the team there so it is impossible to know the code behind.
The only thing I want is that they could review the code, I work in that area, and mine guts say that there is something wrong.
You have to think they will normally program with extreme programming in Continious Integration. If they even allow it, I shall review itself so it will not cost them any money.

I'll already made mine name with mine skills so its a little frustrating that some people who don't work at that project just laugh things away.

Its like someone finds out a construction fault in a engineerings plans.
You don't have to say it can't be cause he can't make faults, and a clever student can find that fault (Already been with a building in Amerika).

For the rest I read that there are characters who have been hacked.
I'll had critic the login issue from the beginning, cause you can allow a bot for just changing pass and try the login very fast with bruteforcing. There is no limit of tries in x time, no warning system when you entered your pw x times wrong with mail,...
If that issue was reported and was impemented many players never had there account lost.

Summarry : Please report to the real programmers if they could review(when they do the refactoring its good for me) the code and report back to us.
Is it to much to ask or can't take playa some critic about there code?
Or is the problem here with the moderaters who .... please fill up yourself so I don't get a yellow card or be banned for this stupid topic.

I'm just trying to help improve the code.

Lilli, can you give me link of the explication of the toilet? I will dig in there than.

Best regards Chill.

[Leander]

I will ask if they changed the code.

Toilet:

http://forum-int.sfgame.net/showthread.php?t=666

http://forum-int.sfgame.net/showthread.php?t=958

[GeorgeKen]

I've got to admit that I have also seen a rather low drop of epics the last few months, but I cannot say for sure if I have seen that drop before or after the toilet (or if it is really a drop or just my imagination in any case)

[chillworld]

Oke after a little cooldown ,

I can be wrong with the update of arcane toilet but it was around that time it came up.
It was mine mistake to put it on that, but still I think there is something wrong, worth checking it, and mine offer that I check it for them for free is still on.
I like playing the game and I just want to help where I can.

Thx Leander for just asking it already.

Greetz chill.

[Cregan]

I've never seen epics in the shop anyway :/

[Leander]

Got my reply...no, the drop rate hasn't been changed.

By the way, the epic event only affects the chance to find epic items in the shops (weapon shop, magic shop)...the chance to find such an item during quests or to get one when you flush the toilet is not higher than on normal days.

[chillworld]

Yes that I'm aware off that's only for the shops and not the toilet or quests.

Is there a possibility that they can review the code, or test it? (system.out.println on the if epic statement when its epic weekend, a ; after the if statement can do weird things and you overlook it so easy)

I still have a hard feeling there is something wrong, just cause there is for me no difference between normal shop or epic weekend shop.

thx in advance.

Chill

[Lillikurd]

Hey Lillikurd,
I'm a little frustrated about your answer.
Let me explain why.
I know you are not a part of the team there so it is impossible to know the code behind.

Improbable, not impossible.

The only thing I want is that they could review the code, I work in that area, and mine guts say that there is something wrong.

I work in "that area" too, *plus* I have a background in statistics. So I know that it's most likely that your guts are just misleading you.

I'll already made mine name with mine skills so its a little frustrating that some people who don't work at that project just laugh things away.

I'm not laughing anything away, first of all there should be something to laugh at.

For the rest I read that there are characters who have been hacked.
I'll had critic the login issue from the beginning, cause you can allow a bot for just changing pass and try the login very fast with bruteforcing. There is no limit of tries in x time, no warning system when you entered your pw x times wrong with mail,...

Also, there's not much evidence of you giving that critic. Where exactly did you put it, who was in charge then and what was the answer you received?


If that issue was reported and was impemented many players never had there account lost.[/quote]

I agree that the login is not as safe as could be. But, on the other hand. Can you give me one example of a player who "lost" his account to a hacker who tried a brute force attack? Or are you honest enough to admit that in reality, those players had just been careless with their passwords (i.e. chose a simple one, gave it away for "sitting" and didn't change it afterwards, etc etc)

I'm just trying to help improve the code.

No, what you do is you claim that there is some problem with the code, without much evidence, and subsequently demand that the code be reviewed. First, please check if you can be sure that there's really something wrong.

[Leander]

Why should they review the code? The code stayed the same.

Users that were hacked either sent their password to others (account sitting etc.), forgot to log out and another person continued playing on a shared computer or - which is the most frequent reason - their password was very unsafe and easy to guess.

e.g. account name and password are the same, account examplewarrior, password examplewarrior or just numbers in increasing order such as "123" or "12345".

[Leander]

I had bad luck yesterday. Only 4 epics after refreshing the weapon shop 100 times. Today the result was completely different: magic shop, spent 15 mushrooms and found 4 epic items, too. By the way, the magic shop and weapon shop are the same concerning the chance to find an epic item.

You are either lucky or have bad luck...it's pure chance after all, similar to a board game. You roll the die and have only 1 6 in twenty rolls but an hour later you roll the 6 three times in a row and have 8 6s in twenty rolls.