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gem mine and gold pit strategy

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    gem mine and gold pit strategy

    So - with the uncapped gem mine and gold pit, what is the best strategy going forward? I mean, it does not make sense to just upgrade the mine like forever, and never get any gem :-). Same thing for the gold pit (apart from the fact, that it takes 3+ years to reach level 225). Has anybody made some calculus on what the smartest thing to do?

    #2
    I think people first need to upgrade the mines and see differences to make some canculations.

    Comment


      #3
      Yeah - it may be people have to check. I just figured, someone already know the formula for what it gives. At least the gold pit? It would be good to have those. Like gold as a function of char level and pit level. And gem bonus and gem cost as function of char level and pit level (and possibly excavation time, if that changes)

      Comment


        #4
        The gem formula is clear:

        lvl char*0.36*[1+0.15*(gem mine lvl-1)]+knights/3

        This is for big primary stat gems. For black gems divide by 2 and add 30%
        I think the final number can have 15% deviation.

        My plans are to finish upgrading gem mine 22, then search for the two keys for the new dungeon, then continue upgrading to level 25. Then search for gems till I upgrade all my current gems. After that I will probably go for 5-10 straight gem mine upgrades followed by a gem search.

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          #5
          TY - Sersemina.
          It may be a good strategy to do so, upgrade gem mine and take advantage of the better gems.
          Further to the increase in stat, it is also interesting to understand how much you get for selling the gems you cannot use. This can be used for permanent stat increase :-P.
          So I am also trying to understand whether there is a change in the time it takes to dig a gem (currently 6,5 hours with the full fortress built) as well as the formula for the value of the gems.

          This latter part is probably much more straightforward for the gold pit. On one side, you can choose to spend the 162 million souls and upgrade the gold pit for 14+ days OR just use the gold pit for getting your gold.
          Just a simple comparison: when do we have the break-even between sticking to gold pit 15 and harvest gold, vs upgrading to lvl 16 - or 17 or 225. Building to level 225 will take 3 years, so for sure the break-even point will be much further out into the future; and nothing to really target for.

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            #6
            My fortress isn't finished yet, so I only have experience with the gold pit.
            Each upgrade takes 15 days.
            The amortization on charlevel 400 is about 250 days after completion of the upgrades.
            Btw the upgrade to stage 255 would need almost 9 years.

            Comment


              #7
              Interesting, tinc.
              Let me see if I understand this correctly:

              At your level 400:
              (What you can collect with a level 15 mine in 250 days)
              equals
              (What you can collect with a level 16 mine in 235 days, minus the 10 mill it cost to upgrade the mine)

              Is that the case?
              If so, with a payback time of 250 days I really dont see a point of upgrading too much / at all... Tomorrow I will have gold pit 17. If the above is true for my level too (495), I will not start benefiting from these 2 upgrades, until after around 500-2*15=470 more days :-P. If I continue upgrading to stage 255 (spending the full 9 years) it will take me 164 years before breakeven???

              Still - I would love to see the formula for the gold payback, including character level and mine level.

              Comment


                #8
                Originally posted by slasker View Post
                Interesting, tinc.
                Let me see if I understand this correctly:

                At your level 400:
                (What you can collect with a level 15 mine in 250 days)
                equals
                (What you can collect with a level 16 mine in 235 days, minus the 10 mill it cost to upgrade the mine)

                Is that the case?
                If so, with a payback time of 250 days I really dont see a point of upgrading too much / at all... Tomorrow I will have gold pit 17. If the above is true for my level too (495), I will not start benefiting from these 2 upgrades, until after around 500-2*15=470 more days :-P. If I continue upgrading to stage 255 (spending the full 9 years) it will take me 164 years before breakeven???

                Still - I would love to see the formula for the gold payback, including character level and mine level.
                The goldmine fills with gold while building. And after upgrade you may get max gold.

                I think we can suggest to increase the max gold with mine level and that potentially will make this mechanic more realistic

                Comment


                  #9
                  I did not get even 25% of gold mine after upgrade.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Originally posted by slasker View Post
                    Interesting, tinc.
                    .. it will take me 164 years before breakeven???

                    Still - I would love to see the formula for the gold payback, including character level and mine level.
                    I'll try my best ..

                    CC = constraction costs
                    LM = lost mining
                    DAV = daily addad value
                    AP = amortization period

                    LM = gold/h * 24 * 15d
                    CC = 10,000,000 + LM

                    Since the gold pit produces one percent of the city guard yield for one hour per stage and hour, the daily added value after expansion corresponds to one percent of the hourly city guard yield times 24, or 1/15 of the previous yield, since our gold pit had already had stage 15 before expansion.

                    DAV = gold/h * 24 / 15stages

                    AP = CC / DAV + 15days

                    CC = 254,500.16 * 24 * 15d = 91,620,057.6 + 10,000,000 = 101,620,057.6

                    DAV = 254,500.16 * 24 / 15s = 407,200.25

                    AP = 101,620,057.6 / 407,200.25 = 249,55 days

                    For each further expansion stage, 15 days of construction time are added up only.
                    Every level up of the char will shorten the amortization period.
                    Anything else is speculation. We don't know yet if there is a limited capacity of the gold pit.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Originally posted by QeniX View Post
                      I did not get even 25% of gold mine after upgrade.
                      sorry, you are right ... it does not fill during upgrade



                      screenshot taken right after the upgrade
                      Last edited by rvm1975; 6 January 2019, 02:08 PM.

                      Comment


                        #12
                        OK - upgrading Gold Pit from level 16 to level 17 gave me an extra 6,25% (=1/16)
                        I guess that the extra % is linear (?). So it looks like this in my view:

                        gold/hour = (gold pit lvl)*(character level dependent base number - which is unknown to me)

                        There is no difference in the time it takes to upgrade the pit (15 days) or the cost of the upgrade (max souls + 10 mill gold).
                        The 10 millions in gold is a variable, when it comes to the payback time (as the base number is level dependent). For my level (495) the math is like this:

                        Gem mine level 16:
                        655,922.2 gold / hour

                        Gem mine level 17:
                        696,917.4 gold / hour

                        Days for the upgrade: 15 = 360 hours
                        Cost of upgrade = 10,000,000

                        Setting x as the number of hours where staying with gem mine lvl 16 or upgrading to lvl will have paid the same back:

                        x*655,922.2 + 10,000,000 = (x-360)*696,914.4
                        <=>
                        10,000,000 +360*696,914.4 = x(696,914.4 - 655,922.2)
                        <=>
                        x=6364 hours = 265 days
                        As mentioned above: x will be lower for higher level and higher for lower level characters. It will never get below 6120 (255 days) though.

                        From the numbers above, there is really no motivation for me to upgrade my gold pit any longer.

                        Comment


                          #13
                          I don't think it's that simple.

                          I recently upgraded to level 17.
                          I gained almost 36k gold / hour.
                          If I would start gathering now I would regain lost 15 days of gold mining within 240 days.
                          However if I will get another 36k gold then I will regain those 30 days in also 240 days.

                          So it all depends on wether the numbers change on higher levels and how long you intend to play, which is hard to say ofc.

                          It is also worth pointing out you lose out 1.37 points of stats daily, while building. It's really not that much.
                          And wasting a litlle over 200 days would allow you to earn 2.5 stat points per day.

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Thank you, Arturu.
                            You are right and now I come to the same conclusion. If we dont count the 10 million for each upgrade, the payback time going from level 16 to 17 is 240 days. Going from 16 to 18 is 255, from 16 to 19 270 etc. So it is only the additional 15 days for each added level. It makes it far more digestible, although there is no clear answer on what will be the best strategy. Of course, it depends on for when you try to maximize the the gold (and thereby stats).

                            Comment


                              #15
                              I appreciate this thread, but realistically how long is it taking everyone to upgrade each level of the gold pit? I'd assume its 20-30 days depending on the age of your server. Wouldn't the delta (5-15 days) also account for the payback into those 240 days?
                              Last edited by Strider; 7 January 2019, 08:00 PM.
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