Christmas Update - Discussion Thread

[LapisUlami]

Originally Posted by Rivale

Here's the deal: Those skill points will cost mushrooms very early, so no f2p member would ever upgrade it beyond lvl 7-10.
When you're in a guild with say 20 members that was fully upgraded and one officer decides to kick members, then the purchased progress above lvl 20 would inevitably be lost.

Every shroom you have can be invested in skills. So you don't have to buy any
and can fully skill after 30 days if you have enough gold. That counts for 50%
mount of course. If you use 30% mount you can do so after about a week.
If only 20 players are in a fully upgraded guild at the update, every player has
51 skills. So even there 10 players can leave the guild without loss of guild skills.

[Kanako]

Originally Posted by Rivale

As of writing this I have 2-3 potential players that I might have to kick for inactivity. That's 130 mushrooms each (21 skill points per member, we're not a fully maxed out guild. In fact I've been having issues finding new members and we're growing very slowly with me regularly having to kick inactive users) and accumalatively 390 mushrooms (going off the price chart that was posted on page 4) or 13 - 39€.

If you were not fully maxed out, how do they have 21 skillpoints? I thought the current upgrade-status would be translated to skill points, so only fully upgraded guilds with 50 members would get 21 skillpoints per member?
But I see your problem with finding new members and having to kick inactive ones.
Still I do not think that you should translate the skillpoints into actual money. And even if you do so – except for the skillpoints that your current members have gotten now because of the update – the skillpoints new members bring with themselves have never been “paid for” with your mushrooms (or the mushrooms of whoever invested them into your guilds updates so far). So it’s not “your” money that you are kicking, it’s theoretically the money of that player. So it is good that this money now stays with them and is not left behind in a guild from which that player does not profit anymore.

Originally Posted by Rivale

Exactly! It doesn't really make much of a difference whether or not the skill points go to those that contributed or distributing evenly in terms of reaching a fully upgraded guild, so why should people even be confronted with the risk of potentially having to repay for a service they've technically already bought?
I can't be expected to have to completely rebuy skill points should I eventually lose too many members or temporarily quit the game.

But as a said later, it is not possible to determine who has contributed to the upgrades of a guild. And even if that was possible, there are older servers where those players do not exist anymore. So if only the members, who spent mushrooms for upgrades of that guild, would get skillpoints then there would be guilds where (almost) no one would have gotten any skillpoints.
Also you do not have to rebuy all the skillpoints in case so many members leave your guild at once (which also might indicate a big problem in your guild). It’s (in my eyes!) the job of the guild leader and his/her officers to explain to the members that it is important that they skill the skillpoints. Yes, not everyone might want to skill all the 10 skillpoints that are needed in average. But still you do not have to skill all 500 points alone.

Originally Posted by Rivale

Instead of having mushrooms and gold clog up in your guild you'll now have tons of inactive players in your guild as it's just not worth it to kick them anymore, since you'll not only lose the hall of knight points, but also the skill points that you effectively purchased yourself.
If you kick them and they try to return after unexpected and unannounced inactivity there'll be drama.
Also what do you think would happen, if an officer willingly (or accidently, might as well happen) were to kick a member?
A single officer would now have the power to crush an entire guild.

As I also wrote later – activity, potions, high level and being well skilled is in the long run much more important than having a lot of skillpoints. As for my experience people who are willing to spent money in this game, also stay and play for quite a long time. So when the time comes that a person with over 100 skillpoints decides to end playing the game, I would imagine that either the guild already has enough dedicated members with 10+ skillpoints to compensate for the loss of this player or that the guild leader and officers would communicate the situation with the members and explain that everyone might have to skill up to skilllevel 10, so we can kick this one person. Maybe they do not even have to skill to level 10 because maybe the leader, the officers or other members already have more than 10 skillpoints so the other members do not have to level as much. So you can deal with such a situation. Also I think it is unlikely for a guild to have many members with 100+ skillpoints that are inactive at the same time suddenly. I mean it can only be 5 max. Because you only need 500 skillpoints. You can handle a time with 5 inactive players until the other members have skilled enough to compensate their loss.
But yes in the early game that would be a problem, if such a person suddenly becomes inactive. But as I said that’s quite unlikely. You know better than I how much money 100 skillpoints are worth. (Someone else also explained why one officer cannot crush an entire guild – even if so – maybe chose your officers wisely)

Originally Posted by Rivale

You're saying, that long-term it would not make a difference, as it's easier to fully upgrade a guild now.
So why the hell did we donate those 5000 mushrooms then?
Where was the purpose in paying so much money?
Please note, that I only recently (near August) started playing this game and even more recently (near halloween) did those purchases.

I also said that we should not judge this upgrade by looking at the way they have handled the transfer. They could not have known, when they first started S&F that a day will come that there will be an update that kinda makes it seem that the invested mushrooms are not fully valued anymore. This update is a good one (in my eyes). The transfer might not be the fairest. But tell me, how else should they have done it?
The mushrooms and the gold that have been put into the upgrades were given back by giving the equivalent (even more) in form of the skillpoints needed to keep the upgrades on the level they were before. You still have the service that you have invested the mushroom and the gold in.
But what I do understand is that you, playing for a short time, are now angry as if you had started to play only a few month later you would not have invested so many mushrooms in upgrades / skillpoints probably. So don’t get me wrong, I do understand your anger. But its “only” the transfer that was not handled perfectly, it’s not the update in its self that is bad.
And still I do not know how the transfer could be handled better.

Originally Posted by Rivale

Up until yesterday donations towards the current guild were recorded.
At least those recorded donations could have been distributed less evenly and more fairly.

I agree in this point. Especially looking at the mushrooms, they could have been distributed proportionally to the amount of mushrooms each member has donated to the current guild.

Originally Posted by Rivale

They didn't invest anything. Why should they stay?
They could just up and open their own guild and easily fully upgrade it.
Getting the raid bonuses would take a while, but wouldn't really be an issue.

As you said “getting the raid bonuses would take a while”. If I was a power-player, someone willing to invest many mushrooms in order to level fast and have a lot of gold, then I would want to be in a guild where I can get the upgrades as high as possible as fast as possible. I would still need others to be able to get the raid bonuses fast (which are half of the upgrades). That’s one reason to stay in a guild. Another reason is: You already are in one of the top 10 guilds, if that’s your goal. But I can tell you, why I stay in my guild – its good communication. Communication is the key (for me). I feel welcomed, I feel good, I feel valued in my guild, I see that the leader and officers care about the guild and its members. Although I and many others have never bought any mushrooms at all. That’s how you can keep your members. And with the new system where the members bring the skillpoints to your guild, guildleaders and their officers are more encouraged to think about what they can do to make the people feel good in their guild and therefore make them stay.

[Exploit]

Where is the key for new dungeons?

[Kanako]

Originally Posted by Exploit

Where is the key for new dungeons?

You can find it in the gem mine of your fortress.

[Sersemina]

Originally Posted by Exploit

Where is the key for new dungeons?

It's in the gem mine. So if you are upgrading it, you will have to wait as I do.

[Magelie]

The old version on Steam hasn't updated properly. New dungeons missing, no pet food storage area (pet food acquired just disappears!), Dr A not working, no doubt various other problems.
Is this going to be fixed? It seems to be working on the remastered version, but I really, really prefer the old one....

[Exploit]

Thanks for key info guys!

Now, on to pet food change...

While I welcome the change, I have a feeling that one small change would make a huge difference. Instead of needing to click on pet we want to feed first and then clicking the "feed" arrow, it would be much simpler to be able to drag and drop food to the desired pet. Maybe even implement the option to automatically switch to corresponding pet panel when you pick up certain food with your mouse.

[slasker]

Speaking of the pet feeding, it would save one click if the highest level feedable pet was selected, rather than the first one... It will take me quite some time, before I will feed that pet ;-). But yes - enabling drag and drop pet food (as it worked previously) would be even better and save me 2 clicks, so I dont have to first select the habitat and next select the pet.

[Kanako]

Originally Posted by slasker

Speaking of the pet feeding, it would save one click if the highest level feedable pet was selected, rather than the first one... It will take me quite some time, before I will feed that pet ;-). But yes - enabling drag and drop pet food (as it worked previously) would be even better and save me 2 clicks, so I dont have to first select the habitat and next select the pet.

Well I just tried and drag + drop works totally fine for me oo''
I had the shadow pets open by default. In my storage I had a strawberry, I draged it to the pets, which automatically switched to the fire pets, and there I dropped the fruit on the pet I wanted to feed. No problem at all.

I play on the new design, Browserversion.
Client V3.021.181218.1

[Exploit]

Originally Posted by Kanako

Well I just tried and drag + drop works totally fine for me oo''
I had the shadow pets open by default. In my storage I had a strawberry, I draged it to the pets, which automatically switched to the fire pets, and there I dropped the fruit on the pet I wanted to feed. No problem at all.

I play on the new design, Browserversion.
Client V3.021.181218.1

It doesn't work on V2