Shakes & Fidget - The Game - Supportboard  

Go Back   Shakes & Fidget - The Game - Supportboard > Game & Support > Bugs & Complaints

Notices

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #11  
Old 30th January 2019, 11:47 AM
bobo baggins's Avatar
bobo baggins bobo baggins is offline
Golden Shroomer
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Gilde: US forum
Posts: 3,100
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by KO771 View Post
All forums do have the right to give input and this forum here did that often enough. You can thank Leander for his work, we are in contact all the time.

BMW is changing the (forum-)game here a bit by telling you that a user vote did change something.
WRONG. The only vote that counts for me is a vote that I set up.
Also that vote he mentions never had any impact on our decision, because the question asked there is totally irrelevant (because it only asks about one "solution" that one user suggested) - and BMW knows that.

So please, do not fool the not-german understanding people by claiming things that never happened that way.

Try using convincing facts, reasons and explanations - those do work for me.
BMW knows that because he knows (and wrote in the thread in the german forum), that the change that will come, is a consensus of almost all reasons that were written by the different users (fun fact: the 100 instead of the 50 is because of his postings).
Yes I know Leander is he is not to blame here Playa is by not asking all community managers to post something asking for input.

That may be that the thread was about 1 solution but no one here knew that it was being talked about and it would have been nice to maybe give an idea that Playa didn't think of that could have been better example raise the lvl of both by say 25-50 levels a year gives players a feeling that they can finish it and not be over whelmed by how much has to be done.

to say in 1 sentence that the thread/discussion had no impact on Playa's decision then in the next say 1 players input had an impact on Playa's contradicts at best some may even consider it an out right lie. I am not saying anyone lied but if you at you could see where some ppl may come to that conclusion.

I have played this game going on 8 years now I went from a newb to helping the then US community to helping here and tbh the way the game has grown (this is my opinion) I am not a fame especially on the 2 remastering of the game has grown. with all the loading issues and bugs that are not getting fixed some being reported from day 1 to seeing something like voices getting added to the game which does nothing for game play other then maybe it sound better. but if you cant load the game or take so long you give up trying all the sounds in the world are useless.

a solution when something like this is discussed and Playa is considering a change ALL forum communities should get a chance to give their input before a final solution is reached.
__________________
have fun, fight hard, die honorably
Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to bobo baggins For This Useful Post:
BMWGuinness (30th January 2019)
  #12  
Old 30th January 2019, 01:33 PM
Arturu Arturu is offline
Epic Raid Leader
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 605
Default

We have to keep things real.

The only impact we, as the community, have is through suggestions and complaints. And it's impossible to ask for more.

Let's take the current example. Playa wants to change max levels of Mines and asks the community about it.
Only fraction of the playerbase gives their input and can settle on a solution that is not actually good for the game. Then Playa comes with a different change and ends up as the bad guy who doesn't care about what players think.

Voting would improve this problem but not by much. A lot can change during just the voting process. Maybe someone gives an even better solution. Maybe they come up with an idea for future content that requires specific solution here. A lot can happen.

No matter the game, if devs actually look at feedback and try to solve bigger complaints then things are good (as good as they can be).


That being said it is one thing to read in a monthly or weekly report "people are mostly not happy with this or that change" and completely another to be on said forum and need to respond to these things.

Also I am really tired of the fact that we get specific changes to time based systems (Fortress / Underworld) without any time to prepare at all.

And why were changes announced only on the German forum?
It might be a good idea to keep forums separate, but it so happens that the servers are worldwide.
Reply With Quote
The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Arturu For This Useful Post:
Alquavene (30th January 2019), beroun (31st January 2019), BMWGuinness (30th January 2019), LapisUlami (30th January 2019)
  #13  
Old 30th January 2019, 03:17 PM
Acclamator Acclamator is offline
Adventurer
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Posts: 95
Default

You need to understand the situation: in the german forum started some rumor quickly after the change to unlimited gems was anounced, many people reacted in a complains thread. Soon a pol was created from a normal user in a seperate thread that was about asking players if they are ok with the change, wanted a cap at 50 or a higher cap and as you might aspect discussion started their too. Some time after that another thread was created in the suggestions categorie suggesting to make a cap at 50, with quite unusual numbers of thankers and a lot of controvers discussion too. Around a week after the first thread some asked why playa doesn't react to all this discussion resulting in KO saying they can not react to something he didn't even forwarded to them, but which he would do that day and later that day he gave a quick feedback about his meeting with his colleagues and their discussion prossumably to cool down all that people. The information from this feedback was soon after posted here from BMW (I guess before Leander could have taken action) and was quickly confirmed by Leander. So changes were anounced in both forums quite simultaniously.

My suggestion for the future would be to not just inform the international community about a change based on discussion and arguments in the german forums, but to inform them about the discussion and arguments itself before making a decission.
The time for this would have been there, because the change will go live just with the next usual update.

Last edited by Acclamator; 30th January 2019 at 03:21 PM.
Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Acclamator For This Useful Post:
BMWGuinness (30th January 2019)
  #14  
Old 30th January 2019, 03:24 PM
bobo baggins's Avatar
bobo baggins bobo baggins is offline
Golden Shroomer
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Gilde: US forum
Posts: 3,100
Default

here is the thing Arturu they only ask one part of the community (German forums) if they had asked ppl on all their forums and ended up with what ever fine ad dandy some may have been upset but t least we would have had a chance to put our 2 cents in on it.

the problem is not that they made the change the problem is they only got input from part of the community. Not saying what I am about to say is true but sure looks like it. it looks like they only care about one portion of the player base.

It isn't a matter if BMW didn't tell us everything or not which KO is trying to make it seem tbh that I don't care about that. what matters is that no one outside of the German forums it would seem even knew that Playa was thinking of changing the cap. That could make players change their strategy I know it will change mine for sure.
__________________
have fun, fight hard, die honorably
Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to bobo baggins For This Useful Post:
BMWGuinness (30th January 2019)
  #15  
Old 30th January 2019, 03:29 PM
BMWGuinness's Avatar
BMWGuinness BMWGuinness is offline
Veteran Epic King
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Posts: 1,863
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by KO771 View Post
BMW is changing the (forum-)game here a bit by telling you that a user vote did change something.
WRONG. The only vote that counts for me is a vote that I set up.
Also that vote he mentions never had any impact on our decision, because the question asked there is totally irrelevant (because it only asks about one "solution" that one user suggested) - and BMW knows that.
I honestly did not know that. Legitimately I thought that the Poll and the request not only influenced the decision, but the timeliness in which the decision was made.

Here is my point of view:

1. I was browsing the German Forums
2. I came across a poll asking for votes on capping the gem mine (a. cap at 50, b. cap above 50, c. leave it d. don't care)
3. The discussion surrounded a player who was already at level 30 gem mine
4. The majority of votes was for a cap at level 50.
5. Someone discovered that my Gem Mine was already at level 45 because I spent a ton of money skipping build times (if you look at my signature, you know I spend money)
6. There were calls for an INSTANT resolution to cap the gem mine at 50 even though there was still a week left in the poll (February 3, 2019)
7. I was extremely concerned because, had I known about a level cap I would have not spent so much money to quickly level my gem mine (we can cover my strategy elsewhere, Sersemina understands)
8. I was told by other players (You knew Playa would cap the gem mine, too bad you spent all that money, tough sh** because of the terms of service) (This is NOT Playa, this was the German Forum + a moderator)
9. I was told if I can't speak German I need to not participate
10. It got heated (Bobo Baggins remembers the good old days of the US Forums) because I was in 100% Defense Mode ... extremely upset that because I was close to 50, and instant solution was being called for ... the real reason (which is in the forums) was to stop me from closing in on the advantage of older servers from having higher placement in the international hall of fame.
11. KO771 said that the gem mine and gold pit would be capped at 100, all discussion on the matter then ceased, I said thank you as I felt this was an excellent compromise.

---

It was a very interesting experience to say the least. From my point of view, I felt like it was me against the German Forum. And I had a language disadvantage because Google Translate is not perfect. I felt like I was angering people because a. I couldn't understand the language properly and b. I was ruining other's gameplay because I was spending money.

I only reacted when members of the German Forum realized I would surpass level 50 soon and they called for an immediate cap, then I went into defensive mode.

---

Yes, I am in agreement that an unlimited gem mine would give an unfair advantage to someone crazy enough to spend a lot of money in the game (yes that is me) and I am driven (its called OCD) to be the best, and this was my chance to catch up to the best in the world (The International Hall of Fame, which gives no benefit other than seeing your name on a competitive wall, which compels me to compete).

I felt like it would be more fair to put a limit on the Gem Mine, I had thought 255 like the Gold Pit. When I saw the poll and the reactions, I quickly changed my mind and thought level 100 would be fair. I even thought that since the German Forum saw someone was so close to 50, they would vote for 100. But I was wrong and realized the cold, hard truth was they wanted an immediate cap of 50.

Then I felt singled out ...

---

My "battle" (what it felt like) on the German Forums is irrelevant, my request is for the International Forum to have an equal voice. If there is a discussion that can impact the global community, please communicate it with the global community.

Had I known, as stated by KO771, that the poll and discussion would have absolutely no influence on the decision making, I might have kept quiet. But I didn't know that, all I knew was a Forum was calling for something that would have nullified my spending of a ton of money. And I went into full defense mode.

---

At the end of the day, just please keep us informed, and please give us a voice.

---

I have thanked Leander several times, as I've said, I feel he is a very good and fair moderator, and keeps a cool head as a mediator.
I also thank you KO771 for the opportunity to let me speak, and I want to thank Playa and its staff for capping the Gem Mine and Gold Pit at 100 instead of 50.
__________________
1st to find all Pets in the World
1st Complete Fortress in the World
1st Complete Underworld in the World
1st to Gem Mine Level 100

Last edited by BMWGuinness; 30th January 2019 at 03:35 PM.
Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to BMWGuinness For This Useful Post:
dfps (3rd February 2019), Shnitel (9th February 2019)
  #16  
Old 30th January 2019, 06:27 PM
Arturu Arturu is offline
Epic Raid Leader
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 605
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bobo baggins View Post
the problem is not that they made the change the problem is they only got input from part of the community. Not saying what I am about to say is true but sure looks like it. it looks like they only care about one portion of the player base.
It's hard to argue with that. It does look this way.

The highlight for me is that a change was made specifically because of one user - BMW.
Thats just too funny.
People there must be pissed.


Side note: I looked through (more like skimmed through) Polish forums. I don't think people there know about changes to Mines cap levels.
Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Arturu For This Useful Post:
beroun (31st January 2019), BMWGuinness (30th January 2019)
  #17  
Old 30th January 2019, 07:14 PM
Leander's Avatar
Leander Leander is online now
Community Manager
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Gilde: UK forum
Posts: 5,117
Default

In my opinion there is no problem of not being heard. You might think certain communities are more important or their thoughts matter more but this is not true. You do not know how Playa and all community managers work behind closed doors.

It is not possible to synchronise the individual posts of a community manager. There are official news and discussions we are told to post but a lot also depends on us individually. We are a team but this fact does not make us robots with machine-like identical behavior.

I understand the bottom line and concern of this thread but I can guarantee that there is no inequality of communities.

One community manager might be a die-hard D&D player and posts a thread in which D&D fans in that local community talk about the hobby. Another community manager might post a joke of the day...other communities might complain why they do not get to read a joke every day but it is not possible to synchronise all content. It does not make sense by the way.
I know I am exaggerating here as your complaint is about essential S&F-related posts and not trivial topics but it's an example nevertheless.

Imagine two situations:

1) After receiving negative Remastered feedback on the gem mine in in-game tickets the German community manager decides to post a poll. In his report to Playa he mentions the poll but Playa also reads the feedback of all other community managers and internally discusses changes where relevant and possible.

2) After receiving negative Remastered feedback on the gem mine in in-game tickets and posts in the forum I did not decide to post a poll BUT I forward your thoughts in my report. Then Playa also reads the feedback of all other community managers and internally discusses changes where relevant and possible.

Both situations yield the same result.
Playa does not add something to or change the game because of a handful of players or a poll in a forum. It is about the TOTAL NUMBER of ALL COMMUNITIES. Criticism and suggestions are collected in all forums, in all tickets and on all social media platforms (Facebook, Twitter, Instagram).
There won't be a poll saying "Post your thoughts and we are going to implement them". It's about the collective S&F playerbase.

Besides, local communities don't differ much or at all. Good updates are loved whereas bad decisions result in negative feedback REGARDLESS of countries and languages.

Therefore, posting the poll elsewhere would not make a difference. The task of a community manager is to collect both negative and positive feedback and forward them to Playa, independent of polls.

Community manager A reports that his/her community likes ... and dislikes...
Community manager B reports that his/her community likes ... and dislikes...
Community manager C reports that his/her community likes ... and dislikes...
Then Playa compares all reports and decides if a change is needed and possible or not.

EDIT Oh, and BMW's opinion does not trigger the gem mine's change. His voice matters but only just as much as every other player's. We do not change the game because of single forum user or players in general but it is about the total amount of players and how many are for or against a change. In BMW's case we do not change something because of him but only if many other players think like him as well! Those don't have to necessarily express their thoughts in the German forum or any other local community but the combined feedback of all forums, the vast amount of support tickets (!), on social media etc. matters. Don't forget we receive many more tickets than forum posts are created every day.
__________________

Shakes & Fidget Community Manager


Like and follow us on Facebook, Twitter and Instagram

Last edited by Leander; 30th January 2019 at 07:20 PM.
Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Leander For This Useful Post:
Arturu (31st January 2019), BMWGuinness (30th January 2019)
  #18  
Old 31st January 2019, 06:15 AM
Arturu Arturu is offline
Epic Raid Leader
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 605
Default

As much as I like and value Leander as CM (believe me, there are reasons why I sit here and not on the Polish forum), and do agree in general with his point of view...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leander View Post
EDIT Oh, and BMW's opinion does not trigger the gem mine's change. His voice matters but only just as much as every other player's.
Quote:
Originally Posted by KO771 View Post
that the change that will come, is a consensus of almost all reasons that were written by the different users (fun fact: the 100 instead of the 50 is because of his postings).
And it's not about making big fuss out of it.
I think it's just funny.

Last edited by Arturu; 31st January 2019 at 06:18 AM.
Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Arturu For This Useful Post:
BMWGuinness (31st January 2019)
  #19  
Old 31st January 2019, 06:26 AM
BMWGuinness's Avatar
BMWGuinness BMWGuinness is offline
Veteran Epic King
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Posts: 1,863
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Arturu View Post
As much as I like and value Leander as CM (believe me, there are reasons why I sit here and not on the Polish forum), and do agree in general with his point of view...
I believe this was taken out of context. I was defending a position with logic. I think the validity of the logic was the persuader, not the fact that it came from one person (no matter how LOUD that person can be ). I'm sure now that I understand Playa's position that they had already considered that variable while discussing it internally. So I believe it was the logic and circumstance that a player was already close to the 50 cap that finalizing the cap at 100 would be satisfactory across as many parties as possible. I am certainly very grateful of their decision.
__________________
1st to find all Pets in the World
1st Complete Fortress in the World
1st Complete Underworld in the World
1st to Gem Mine Level 100
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 5th February 2019, 10:34 AM
Wasi Wasi is offline
Mushroom Collector
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Posts: 70
Default

As I already said on the german forum, i really wanted the limit (yeah same nick here and there). a limit, even it would have been 225, would have been a limit. I didn't care and i knew you spend your money on a game and want an advantage, same for me on other games.
You entered the german forum to discuss with us and that you not wanted to have a limit at 50 was understanding for me (i was the spy). That the german forum is not colleagues like you have known on other forums, if some have their opinion they will sometime really get harsh, even i have to back out sometimes. And for you we have made the exception, that you also could write it in english, even if you just translate it via google and paste it, wouldn't care. You know german only forum, the way you were driven out the first time ....
I were glad to see you participate there and to get your opinion, because of the number one, who has done first everything the fastest way (buying is legit, so also here a congrats from me afterwards).

Last edited by Wasi; 5th February 2019 at 10:38 AM.
Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Wasi For This Useful Post:
BMWGuinness (6th February 2019)
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 11:05 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright by 'Playa Games GmbH'